Author Topic: CS 4400 Very hard to pull.  (Read 421 times)

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Offline Garfield43

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CS 4400 Very hard to pull.
« on: August 25, 2017, 08:51:26 pm »
I apologize in advance, this will be a long post.  I do not want to leave out any info that might help.  A little over 10 years ago I bought a CS 4400.  It has been great and gave no problems until now.  It did have a quirk in that when it had set off season the easiest way to get it to start was to pull the plug and give the rope a few pulls to get some gas into the carb and combustion chamber.  After that put the plug back and it would fire right up.  I only mention this because my father in law said it sounded like it might have a valve hanging up.

It had been setting in it's case in the basement for 4 or 5 years and I needed to get it going.  I took the chain in to get sharpened and put fresh gas in it.  I use Echo brand 2 cycle oil mixed just a little more oil per gallon than the instuctions say. I pulled the spark plug out then pulled the rope and the rope did not retract.  I ordered a replacement recoil spring, installed it and a new rope.

I give it a few pulls with the spark plug out then put the plug in.   It is much harder to pull than it used to be.  I had my wife try it incase it is just that I am that much weaker than I was.  She agreed it was much harder than it used to be.  I took off the bar,chain, chain brake and muffler.  The piston and cylinder look smooth and shiney.  The spark arrestor was not plugged,neither was the muffler.  The exhaust port was black but had no carbon build up.  I poured some Marvel Mystery Oil down the plug hole and in the exusat port and let it set a few minutes.  I then pulled the rope a half dozen times.   It pulls smooth and easy with the plug out.  With the plug in it is very hard to pull.

I actually managed to get it to start and run before I pulled the muffler.  I let it run about 10 minutes and then tried to restart it and it was just as hard to pull. After about a dozen pulls it fired back up.

It used to be easier to pull and it used to start on the second pull.  It ran and worked fine when I finally got it started.  I have been all over the internet  and followed all the advice I could find.  I found an exploded parts diagram online.  The only valve I can find is a check valve in the oil tank.  I don't think that is what my father in law was talking about. 

Can anyone here tell me what I should try next?

Thanks

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Offline Garfield43

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Re: CS 4400 Very hard to pull.
« Reply #1 on: August 26, 2017, 02:18:54 am »
I have read several hard pulling threads on here and I think I may have found the problem.  I did not use official Echo rope but Koch Industries Nylon Starter Rope by the foot from the farm store.   It may be slightly thinner.  This is what I used. https://www.amazon.com/Koch-5570046-200-Feet-Braided-Starter/dp/B004PDFQCA
It says it is "size 4.5" but doesn't actually say 4.5mm.  I will see if the Echo dealer has any Echo rope.  When I tried to get an air filter from him he wanted more for an aftermarket one than I could get a Echo air and fuel filter and spark plug set off of ebay.
I tore a piece out of the muffler gasket getting the muffler off. The missing piece is stuck to the muffler Should I replace that or will it be ok since I still have the piece?

Thanks again

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Re: CS 4400 Very hard to pull.
« Reply #2 on: August 26, 2017, 07:08:42 am »
I think you are on the right track by replacing the rope.

As far as the valve is concerned 2 stroke engines that are used in chainsaws have no valves of any kind.   The intake and exhaust is controlled by porting in the cylinder walls.    Some older saws did use reed valves but only on the intake.    I do not believe your saw has reed valves.
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Offline Cut4fun .

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Re: CS 4400 Very hard to pull.
« Reply #3 on: August 26, 2017, 09:34:31 am »
4.5 is like what is used on the big cc saws. See if you can find 3.5 or 4. Not sure what yours came with.

I dont worry so much about  gaskets on the mufflers.   But if a plastic crankcase saw under muffler I would if it was sending hot exhaust down at it.
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Offline Garfield43

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Re: CS 4400 Very hard to pull.
« Reply #4 on: August 26, 2017, 02:48:14 pm »
The manual says to use 3.5mm (.14") rope Echo part # 99944400045 wich has been superseded by part # 99944445000.
The #4.5 I put on it is a little thinner than what was on it.

If I can't get anything from the dealer I may get this.  It says it is 9/64" that comes out to . 140625".
I suspect the dealer in town will have a roll of this, they seem to use Stens parts instead of Echo.
https://www.amazon.com/Stens-146-915-True-Starter-100-Feet/dp/B004HSBKJQ/ref=sr_1_1?s=lawn-garden&ie=UTF8&qid=1503771427&sr=1-1&keywords=starter+rope+3.5mm

I assume #4.5 does not equal 4.5mm?  This says it is #4.5 like the Koch Industries stuff did but it list an actual size unlike the Koch stuff.

Offline mountainlake

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Re: CS 4400 Very hard to pull.
« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2017, 07:17:37 am »

 If the rope is too small it can wedge in beside itself making it real hard to  pull, also make sure get the spool fully wound but not so much that it comes to the end of the spring which would make the spring break.  Fully wound will pull over easier than less rope on the spool.  Steve
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Offline Cut4fun .

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Re: CS 4400 Very hard to pull.
« Reply #6 on: August 28, 2017, 11:02:22 am »
I was talking in mm above.

Been trying to find a mm and # comparison chart. Haven't found a good one yet.
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Re: CS 4400 Very hard to pull.
« Reply #7 on: August 28, 2017, 11:04:43 am »
Bingo out of the blue  :P

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Re: CS 4400 Very hard to pull.
« Reply #8 on: August 28, 2017, 11:10:24 am »
Good job on finding that Kevin.
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Offline Garfield43

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Re: CS 4400 Very hard to pull.
« Reply #9 on: August 28, 2017, 03:44:25 pm »
Thanks for that chart.
According to that the stuff I bought should work.
It is thinner however you can tell by looking.
I won't have a chance to get to the dealer for a few days.
I will let you know if the new rope fixes it.
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