Chainsaw Repair

Husqvarna - Stihl - Poulan - Jonsered - Dolmar chainsaws and more => Stihl => Topic started by: taylorsmissbeehaven on July 31, 2013, 01:26:34 pm

Title: stihl 044 building
Post by: taylorsmissbeehaven on July 31, 2013, 01:26:34 pm
I hate to ask, but what is the 10mm 12mm difference with the 044. My mechanic didn't know what I was talking about. Judging by the serial number, this saw is a 10mm. 10mm what?!!!??? Thanks for the info in advance and feel free to throw out any other tips and advice this is my first go at this, Brian
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Cut4fun . on July 31, 2013, 01:34:42 pm
I dont know these well but guessing wrist pin size.

Digging up info.  1128 030 0406 This crankshaft has a 15mm piston pin bore. Model 044 chainsaws built before serial number X 29 382 283 (1994) have a 14mm piston pin bore. See part number 1128 030 0401
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: cowroy on July 31, 2013, 01:50:46 pm
You are right, it means 10mm piston pin or 12mm piston pin. If you have a 10mm, they typically make a better runner because of more aggressive port timing numbers. This is from what i have read.
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: taylorsmissbeehaven on July 31, 2013, 03:07:19 pm
Thanks guys that is good to know. I am ashamed to say that the folks at two local dealerships acted like I was crazy when I brought it up telling me that it had a 50mm piston. Oh well :o Thanks again Brian
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: H 2 H on October 15, 2013, 04:37:22 am
I've been working on these saws lately and I sent a email to Stihl and this is part of what info was sent of me



"... piston pin switching from 10mm to 12mm at serial number 129583701"
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Adirondackstihl on October 15, 2013, 08:06:35 am
All 044/440's have a 50mm bore.
Early 044's had a 10mm wrist pin (see serial # above).
The early 10mm saws had more aggressive port timing.
Also had lower volume crank case and transfer tunnels which increase charge velocity.

They are strong running saws, I own 2 of them  :-*

The downside is that they had weak bottom ends
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: 660magnum on October 15, 2013, 09:34:34 am
Cut4fun recently had a 044 at his house to work on. It was very impressive. I have several other brand 70cc chainsaws and this 044 for being stock was better than all of the stock ones I have.

I might add that he had a 046 along the same time and it wasn't as impressive for its size as the 044 was.

The 046 just didn't have that magic sound.
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: jockeydeuce on October 15, 2013, 02:03:55 pm
You can identify a 10mm 044 by the orientation of the cooling fins on top of the cylinder....10mm saws have angled fins and 12mm saws have straight across fins.

Make sure your Stihl gurus don't put a 10mm piston in a 12mm jug as there is a good chance of a ring catch, due to differences in port positions.
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Icehouse on October 15, 2013, 07:32:19 pm
But as I been told you can put a 10mm cylinder on a 12mm piston. This is a very desirable option, giving best of both worlds. Also some early 12mm cylinders had the 45° fins. Hope this is of some help, I've been looking for a 10mm saw for some time, I'll find one eventually  ;)
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Adirondackstihl on October 15, 2013, 08:14:40 pm
10mm saws have angled fins and 12mm saws have straight across fins.

Early 12mm saws also had angled fins. The only true way to know for sure is to run the serial # or measure the wrist pin diameter.
My 10mm 044's will outcut a newer MS460.

The 10mm saws have a sound like no other 044/440. If you've ever ran one or heard one run......you know what I mean.
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Adirondackstihl on October 15, 2013, 08:16:15 pm
But as I been told you can put a 10mm cylinder on a 12mm piston. This is a very desirable option, giving best of both worlds. Also some early 12mm cylinders had the 45° fins. Hope this is of some help, I've been looking for a 10mm saw for some time, I'll find one eventually  ;)

Yes, you can run a 10mm cylinder on a 12mm saw, but it aint gonna run like it did on the 10mm crankcase. Case volume!!
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Cut4fun on October 15, 2013, 08:19:42 pm
But as I been told you can put a 10mm cylinder on a 12mm piston. This is a very desirable option, giving best of both worlds. Also some early 12mm cylinders had the 45° fins. Hope this is of some help, I've been looking for a 10mm saw for some time, I'll find one eventually  ;)

Yes, you can run a 10mm cylinder on a 12mm saw, but it aint gonna run like it did on the 10mm crankcase. Case volume!!



I was wondering about that and flywheels, timing  etc. 
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Adirondackstihl on October 15, 2013, 08:21:55 pm
If anyone is looking for a 10mm Meteor piston kit, I have one.

There is a slight factory defect in it however.
During the manufacturing process, particularly the locating pin installation, the piston was not indexed properly so the locating pins are technically on the wrong side of the piston.
I was going to run just a single ring (top), but after speaking with Meteor directly, they decided to let me keep the defect and shipped me a new piston.
I cleaned up the casting flash in the windows and opened em up a little.
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Adirondackstihl on October 15, 2013, 08:23:48 pm
But as I been told you can put a 10mm cylinder on a 12mm piston. This is a very desirable option, giving best of both worlds. Also some early 12mm cylinders had the 45° fins. Hope this is of some help, I've been looking for a 10mm saw for some time, I'll find one eventually  ;)

Yes, you can run a 10mm cylinder on a 12mm saw, but it aint gonna run like it did on the 10mm crankcase. Case volume!!



I was wondering about that and flywheels, timing  etc. 

Yes, flywheels are heavier on the 10mm saws IIRC. I believe timing is the same however.
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Adirondackstihl on October 15, 2013, 08:31:16 pm
Meet Chrisine!! A very special 10mm
(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w84/stripper_album/Idiot%20Logging%20LLC/_MG_4933e.jpg) (http://s174.photobucket.com/user/stripper_album/media/Idiot%20Logging%20LLC/_MG_4933e.jpg.html)

Here is her 10mm sister
(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w84/stripper_album/Idiot%20Logging%20LLC/_MG_4932e.jpg) (http://s174.photobucket.com/user/stripper_album/media/Idiot%20Logging%20LLC/_MG_4932e.jpg.html)

Brought a few toys out to play this weekend while clearing my back yard :)
Left to Right
Christine (10mm 044), 10mm 044, 034, 346XP, Shindaiwa 360, Super 2
(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w84/stripper_album/Idiot%20Logging%20LLC/_MG_4928e.jpg) (http://s174.photobucket.com/user/stripper_album/media/Idiot%20Logging%20LLC/_MG_4928e.jpg.html)

Left to Right
MS260 Pro, MS261, 550XPG, 562XPg, 395XPG (all Huskies in this pic were build by Terry Landrum)
(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w84/stripper_album/Idiot%20Logging%20LLC/_MG_4927e.jpg) (http://s174.photobucket.com/user/stripper_album/media/Idiot%20Logging%20LLC/_MG_4927e.jpg.html)
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Adirondackstihl on October 15, 2013, 08:33:28 pm
Another shot of "Christine"  8)

(http://i1247.photobucket.com/albums/gg634/Adirondackstihl/_MG_2805_zps2f1df05b.jpg) (http://s1247.photobucket.com/user/Adirondackstihl/media/_MG_2805_zps2f1df05b.jpg.html)
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: jmester on October 15, 2013, 08:43:53 pm
Nice saws, very clean.
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Icehouse on October 15, 2013, 09:11:27 pm
Another shot of "Christine"  8)

(http://i1247.photobucket.com/albums/gg634/Adirondackstihl/_MG_2805_zps2f1df05b.jpg) (http://s1247.photobucket.com/user/Adirondackstihl/media/_MG_2805_zps2f1df05b.jpg.html)


I'm so jealous 2 10 mm, someday I will find one to rebuild and join you.    ;)
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: 660magnum on October 15, 2013, 09:45:49 pm
Christine looks pristine laying there in the grass like she is ready to go.
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Adirondackstihl on October 15, 2013, 09:55:05 pm
Here is the piston issue I was talking about

(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w84/stripper_album/IMG_0008-16.jpg) (http://s174.photobucket.com/user/stripper_album/media/IMG_0008-16.jpg.html)

(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w84/stripper_album/IMG_0006-14.jpg) (http://s174.photobucket.com/user/stripper_album/media/IMG_0006-14.jpg.html)

(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w84/stripper_album/IMG_0005-16.jpg) (http://s174.photobucket.com/user/stripper_album/media/IMG_0005-16.jpg.html)

(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w84/stripper_album/IMG_0011-9.jpg) (http://s174.photobucket.com/user/stripper_album/media/IMG_0011-9.jpg.html)
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Adirondackstihl on October 15, 2013, 09:58:24 pm
This is the replacement piston I received from Meteor. I did a little window cleaning  ;)

Before
(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w84/stripper_album/_MG_2314e.jpg) (http://s174.photobucket.com/user/stripper_album/media/_MG_2314e.jpg.html)

After
(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w84/stripper_album/_MG_2315e.jpg) (http://s174.photobucket.com/user/stripper_album/media/_MG_2315e.jpg.html)

(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w84/stripper_album/IMG_0002-15.jpg) (http://s174.photobucket.com/user/stripper_album/media/IMG_0002-15.jpg.html)

(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w84/stripper_album/IMG_0004-6.jpg) (http://s174.photobucket.com/user/stripper_album/media/IMG_0004-6.jpg.html)

(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w84/stripper_album/IMG_0001-5.jpg) (http://s174.photobucket.com/user/stripper_album/media/IMG_0001-5.jpg.html)
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: fastleo151 on October 15, 2013, 10:28:57 pm
I cant get into 044, 440 saws,  I would rather have my 460 or 461 any day.noticeably more torque in my opinion, and I haven't ever seen a stock 044 out cut a 460 New or old.... but I don't get out much
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Adirondackstihl on October 15, 2013, 10:31:19 pm
I cant get into 044, 440 saws,  I would rather have my 460 or 461 any day.noticeably more torque in my opinion, and I haven't ever seen a stock 044 out cut a 460 New or old.... but I don't get out much

An old 10mm 044 will out cut a new EPA choked out 460.
I guess you've never ran one? Maybe you should get out more ;)
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: fastleo151 on October 15, 2013, 10:38:16 pm
I had a 10mm 044 last year but  sent it packing,  so what is choked up on the 460?  I believe that my 460 had  the same deflector in the muffler as my 046.  I just thought they changed the combustion chambers a little over time....
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Adirondackstihl on October 15, 2013, 10:42:41 pm
For starters, the exhaust outlet that can be plugged with a bic pen
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: jockeydeuce on October 16, 2013, 12:47:54 pm
I've found the only thing the 460 gained was weight.....A 10mm 044 will keep right up and feel better doing it!

That's speaking stock vs stock.
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Adirondackstihl on October 16, 2013, 12:53:51 pm
A 10mm 044 will keep right up and feel better doing it!

That's speaking stock vs stock.

Exactly!!! Hard to beat a 10mm. Those who knock em must drink the orange Kool-Aid regularly or are just here to argue for the sake of arguing.......gnome sayin :)
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: fastleo151 on October 16, 2013, 06:01:27 pm
I'm by no means saying its a bad saw, I am saying a 460 has more torque than  044/440 and I have not seen one out cut a 460 especially in 20 inch plus wood.
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Adirondackstihl on October 16, 2013, 06:12:01 pm
I'm by no means saying its a bad saw, I am saying a 460 has more torque than  044/440 and I have not seen one out cut a 460 especially in 20 inch plus wood.

The 10's I have will out cut up to 25"
Not arguing the torque comment, just sayin
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: H 2 H on October 18, 2013, 05:13:14 pm
I'm in the need of a new piston/rings for a 10 mm

(http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g317/H2H_PHOTOS/MS%20250/044%2010%20mm/IMAG0472_zpsa301273f.jpg)

My second 10 mm saw  ;D
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: H 2 H on October 18, 2013, 05:26:00 pm
Oh and a 10 mm is about .392
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Adirondackstihl on October 18, 2013, 05:26:34 pm
Meteor kit $49.99  ;)
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: H 2 H on October 18, 2013, 05:28:02 pm
Meteor kit $49.99  ;)


That's what im getting :)
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Icehouse on October 18, 2013, 05:49:01 pm
I could save you a lot of trouble, you could sell me the saw and your worries would be over. Good looking saw, good luck with your rebuild. 
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: H 2 H on October 18, 2013, 10:08:17 pm
I could save you a lot of trouble, you could sell me the saw and your worries would be over. Good looking saw, good luck with your rebuild. 

I needed a winter project saw

This is a early EPA saw 1993 from what Stihl has said in a email

Everything has been ordered for the rebuild
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: dutchsawdoctor on October 19, 2013, 02:48:54 am
This is the replacement piston I received from Meteor. I did a little window cleaning  ;)

Before
(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w84/stripper_album/_MG_2314e.jpg) (http://s174.photobucket.com/user/stripper_album/media/_MG_2314e.jpg.html)

After
(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w84/stripper_album/_MG_2315e.jpg) (http://s174.photobucket.com/user/stripper_album/media/_MG_2315e.jpg.html)

Thanks for the look in your kitchen(http://i1148.photobucket.com/albums/o578/dutchsawdoctor1/super.gif)

Title: Re: building 044
Post by: H 2 H on October 19, 2013, 04:18:49 pm
I could save you a lot of trouble, you could sell me the saw and your worries would be over. Good looking saw, good luck with your rebuild. 

THX; I spent some time this morning taking it apart

There isn't any saw dust or dirt around the cylinder fins :)

I rebuilt the carb also this morning and it was clean as it could be

The hoses was something else they were so soft I don't think they would have lasted long; this saw is from the early 90's
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Icehouse on October 19, 2013, 04:38:51 pm
The pictures sure looked like a clean saw, will be real nice when done. Thought I had a 10mm found fins on the cylinder were right had red choke lever but when I finally got the serial number turned out to be an early 12 mm.  :-[
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Icehouse on October 28, 2013, 07:47:31 pm
Well I think I found a 10mm  friend is going to bring it by sometime next week. Don't know what it needs but he says it runs strong. Hope when I'm done it looks as good as yours. ;)
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: H 2 H on October 28, 2013, 09:10:10 pm
Nice

I'm having problems finding a 3/4" wrap handle seems the places I've look/been to are out of stock at this time
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: Icehouse on October 28, 2013, 09:49:49 pm
There are 2 3/4 wraps on fleabay as we speak, not sure they would be as good as you may want for your project, I can't find any new ones. Next time I'm at my saw shop I'll look in the rafters, that's where they hang them, and let you know. Good luck

I have a used set for a 066 don't know if they would work, I don't think so.
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: H 2 H on November 02, 2013, 04:20:21 am
There are 2 3/4 wraps on fleabay as we speak, not sure they would be as good as you may want for your project, I can't find any new ones. Next time I'm at my saw shop I'll look in the rafters, that's where they hang them, and let you know. Good luck

I have a used set for a 066 don't know if they would work, I don't think so.

I have one now :)

(http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g317/H2H_PHOTOS/MS%20250/044%2010%20mm/IMAG0497_zpsfacb61e1.jpg)

I'm getting closer just need more time to many things going on right now

Oh yeah in the background of that pic is another 10 mm spare top end
Title: Re: building 044
Post by: dutchsawdoctor on November 02, 2013, 07:38:47 am
Look nice, and good to have a spare ;)