Chainsaw Repair

Chain - Grinders - Filing - Wood Milling - Tools - Welding - Machinist - Mowers - Tillers => Chain - Bars - Grinders - Filing => Topic started by: winland on October 24, 2013, 07:00:10 pm

Title: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: winland on October 24, 2013, 07:00:10 pm
Is the woodlandpro chainbreaker and spinner combination the best for occasional use.
I see that Bailey's has it on sale for $100
I figure if I make or repair 30 chains over the next few years, it is worth the investment.
They also have the the male presets for .63 and female straps for .41  (3/8" x .050)
are these pretty good prices?

I could take my chains to my local Stihl dealer for repair or to make loops, but they can take 2 weeks to get them back to me.
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: HolmenTree on October 24, 2013, 07:43:20 pm
Is the woodlandpro chainbreaker and spinner combination the best for occasional use.
I see that Bailey's has it on sale for $100
I figure if I make or repair 30 chains over the next few years, it is worth the investment.
They also have the the male presets for .63 and female straps for .41  (3/8" x .050)
are these pretty good prices?

I could take my chains to my local Stihl dealer for repair or to make loops, but they can take 2 weeks to get them back to me.
I have owned a Stihl bench mount breaker for over 20 yrs now and still works great, and just bought my first bench spinner last spring from Baileys and it's the red Woodland Pro model your looking at. It is top quality no doubt and will last me a lifetime.
When I don't have new presets from my rolls I just reuse my presets as long as their pressed out straight with no bends, just have to use a ball peen hammer to rivet them..
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: winland on October 24, 2013, 07:59:35 pm
Do not think I can justify spending $200+ for a Stihl breaker and another $200+ for a spanner at this time in my life.
They would definitely out last me and get sold off in the estate auction. ;D
Will check Craigslist for any specials on the Stihl NG7
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: 660magnum on October 24, 2013, 08:48:22 pm
Harbor Freight is like $54.95 for their spinner/breaker
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on October 24, 2013, 10:16:59 pm
I have had the Bailey's set for a few years now.  It is actually larger and heavier duty than it looks in the catalog photo.  Has worked well for a large number of chains. Good deal at that price.

One of the key things is the ability to get parts.  Punches break, especially when you are learning to center them.  I know at least one guy with a HF unit who cannot use it because he cannot get replacement punches that fit.

I would also order a few extra punches and a assortment of pre-sets and tie straps for all of the chains you use, might think you will use, or might work on for friends.  They are about $1 a set, but shipping will kill you if you ever just need a few! 

There are different sizes for different chain pitches, gauges (sometimes), Narrow Kerf chain, and brands (Bailey's will fit Carlton, Oregon, and a few others chains, but NOT STIHL - have to get those from a dealer or off of eBay).  Sometimes, guys who buy chain by the reel with have a few extra.

Spinner / breaker is a great investment for chain maintenance, even if you don't make up your own loops.  Let's you replace damaged cutters or links.  Let's you re-size chains to fit different saws/bars,  re-purpose used chains (great for a chain scrounger like me!).  Etc.

Philbert

Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Cut4fun . on October 24, 2013, 10:41:41 pm
I'm using the baileys set for 3-4 years now. Worth the $100 for the set.

prices high on the presets and tie straps though. JMO
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: 3000 FPS on October 24, 2013, 10:48:46 pm
I have the Bailey's also and have no complaints except the punches break easy.   So I found a thread here on this forum I think in the tool section on making your own punch.   So I did make my own punch using an old tap that had broken.   I have used that punch numerous times now and it has held up 10 times better than the ones from Baileys.
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on October 24, 2013, 11:10:28 pm
"prices high on the presets and tie straps though. JMO"

I'm all ears if you know of any place to buy/order them cheaper (assuming that you don't get them with a reel of chain)? My local STIHL dealer charges more, even when I ordered them in packs of 10.

In another forum breaking punches was discussed, and centering them over the rivets appears to be key. Some breaker anvils are easier to position than others.

I don't re-use the pre-sets. The tie straps can often be re-used, but you have to be careful, as some hard to see burrs can prevent the spun rivets from seating properly, especially on smaller pitch chain.

Philbert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: 660magnum on October 25, 2013, 01:30:00 am
There's a vid on Youtube about making your own punch. You use soft round stock to make the body with a notch for the set screw.

There is a center hole that you insert a needle bearing roller into. Then taper the needle roller by mounting the punch in a drill and spinning it against a spinning grinding wheel.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=itM286zYaXg
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: 660magnum on October 25, 2013, 04:36:50 am
The bigger problem with tools like the Harbor Freight combination Breaker/Spinner is one of quality control.

One guys HF combo tool couldn't be nicer and has lasted well with no broken punches or anything for many rolls of chain.

And then the next guy has one that is almost unusable.

The biggest problem seems to be the two sides of the spinner will not be aligned. The next big problem is the anvil to rest the chain on to press the rivet out is machined slightly narrow and will not clear the connector plate so the driver will rest properly. This problem will also cause the punch to break. And last the hole in the spinner shaft is not on center and will wobble all over. I read all this on the customer reviews on the HF website.
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Cut4fun on October 25, 2013, 09:30:50 am
I just buy sets in bulk online coming out to .25 a set to never more then .50 a set buying in bulk.   Like right now 56 sets $15.
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: winland on October 25, 2013, 09:44:40 am
OK, you forgot to tell us where you are getting these good prices? ???
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Cut4fun . on October 25, 2013, 09:58:09 am
Several places, not just one when I search and buy.  You have to know how to buy wise or you will spend baileys prices or more.  Buying presets tie straps from a stihl dealer, nope not me never ever.  I couldnt even imagine doing that.
 
 Learn to search different ways  ;), online = feebay, online used parts dealers that sale bulk chain, then online new parts dealers are most expensive. My last choice of buying them at would be baileys. 
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: HolmenTree on October 25, 2013, 10:12:01 am
Trick is to keep the chain level on the breaker anvil, I have a foot square piece of 3/4" plywood with another 1/4" or so layer layered on it with the center cutout ,surrounding the bench breaker. A corner of the plywood is cut out allowing clearance for the handle.
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on October 25, 2013, 12:24:47 pm
660Magnum - I really like the replacement punch video!  But I am not a machinist. I would have to pay someone a lot more (in cash or beer) to make one for me than the $5 -$6 for the replacement ones (assuming that they are available).   That would be a great service to offer on a forum like this!

That is also a good reason to consider the Oregon brand sets - parts availability is more reliable.

Cut4Fun - I have spent a few hours searching eBay for pre-sets. You may have better luck or may be more persistent!  Often can't find specific size/type needed (unless its a very common Oregon size), and then once you add the shipping, it is often not such a good deal.

With Bailey's I can order by the piece at the same price (actually cheaper than their bulk pricing?) and I always add them to an existing order, so shipping is 'free'.

The best deal is a 'buddy' who runs one size chain, buys in reels, and has lots left over!  I have collected more than a dozen different types for various chains I work on, and that is not counting that the newer ones are different on the Right and Left sides.  Obviously, it is easier if you only use one or two sizes/types of chain.

Buying from the STIHL dealer was for a re-sizing project: when we upgraded from MS250's to MS261's the new saws used the same chains, but due to the different mount bar, a '16-inch loop' was now 67 drive links instead of 62 DL. I 'spun up' two dozen or so loops, saving us the cost of replacement, but needed 2 sets per loop.

Philbert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Cut4fun . on October 25, 2013, 12:56:23 pm
Takes me a min or less to search just like the 56 sets for $15 shipped today.   ;)  Just saying.  :P
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on October 25, 2013, 01:14:17 pm
Great deal!  I may start buying from you!

Philbert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Cut4fun . on October 25, 2013, 01:23:47 pm
I keep extras on hand for me and locals.  I dont sale them though.   
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: sharkey on October 26, 2013, 12:23:47 am
chain parts: http://www.psep.biz/store/oregon_3_8_pitch_chain_parts.htm
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: 660magnum on October 26, 2013, 12:39:39 am
chain parts: http://www.psep.biz/store/oregon_3_8_pitch_chain_parts.htm

$7.95 Flat rate shipping from this vendor
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Cut4fun . on October 26, 2013, 09:31:39 am
chain parts: http://www.psep.biz/store/oregon_3_8_pitch_chain_parts.htm

$7.95 Flat rate shipping from this vendor

Thats is one of the many places I check before ordering new stuff.

Used to be $6.95 so they didnt spike it like others.  I ordered 32" bar and $7 to shp.  Saws was $7 also and free if over a certain amount at one time. 
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: 660magnum on October 26, 2013, 09:37:14 am
Over $300 and they are free
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: 660magnum on October 26, 2013, 11:35:50 am
When I was a kid in the South during the 50's, the next door neighbor was a regional representative for Lombard. He also worked on saws on the weekend. Sometimes it was warranty investigations and sometimes it was just working on some local guy's chainsaw. The engines in these Lombard's were West Bends and Tecumseh (or Power Products). Most of what I saw him do were the minor light maintenance things like spark plugs, air filters, and chains. I don't remember him spending much time filing chains?

When he was making up a chain loop or replacing a cutter in a chain, he had a hand chain breaker like the Oregon pocket job today which consisted of the typical slotted anvil/punch and his trusty ball peen hammer. He would work on the saws and chains on the back steps of the house. He had a one car garage with a work bench down one side but he always worked on the back steps. There was a couple acres of trees in the back yard to try them out.
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on October 26, 2013, 12:01:13 pm
Thanks!  Bookmarked that page.  Not too far From my house either - will have to swing by some time.

With that shipping cost it works out to about 75 - 96 cents each, total, if you only order one package. And you have to order in packs of 25.  At Bailey's I can buy individual links at the same price.  But Bailey's shipping costs can be tricky (I keep small items on their 'wish list' to make up minimum orders).

But with the flat rate shipping at Pat's,  the cost really drops with any quantity. 

Thanks again Sharkey!

Philbert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: 660magnum on October 27, 2013, 06:24:35 pm
Speaking of Breakers, Spinners, presets, and tie straps

When you start to buy Stihl presets, they make no mention of the gauge (.050,.058,&.063) I was visiting Cut4fun this afternoon and I brought this up. So we got some Stihl RS33 off the nail and measured the thickness of the drivers. They were .050" where they run though the bar rails BUT were .063" between the tie straps.

In the Internet link supplied in the post earlier about Oregon presets, I noticed the preset numbers were the same for .050" & .058" with a different preset number for the "75" chain. Cut4fun measured some Oregon LGX72 chain and it was .050" where the driver runs through the bar rails but .058" between the tie straps.

With the presets, there is a shoulder where the driver link rides on the rivet. It is a larger diameter than where the rivet goes through the tie strap. The length of this shoulder has to be the same as the thickness of the driver link within the body of the chain itself.

With Oregon chain if you use a .050" preset on .063" gauge chain, it will bind up and be stiff because the shoulder is not long enough. With Oregon, .050" gauge presets will work fine on .058" chain. But .063" presets on .050" chain will be sloppy.

Cut4fun had mentioned years ago that Oregon presets would not work on Stihl chain because the joint would bind. That is because his Oregon presets were for Oregon .050" chain and they had a .058" shoulder on the rivet. Where as Stihl 3/8 chain has drivers that are all .063 thick between the tie straps.

The moral to this story is that Oregon presets for .050" gauge 3/8 chain will mostly work with Oregon .058" gauge chain.

With Stihl 3/8 presets, one size fits all three RS gauges (.050", .058", & .063")

What counts is the thickness of the driver links up inside the chain.
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Al Smith on October 27, 2013, 06:32:09 pm
I have an Oregon spinner  I got from from flea bay cheap .It was missing the spinner anvil which was 5 bucks .I've got about 20 in it .I can do 3/8" and .404 .The little chain I have a set of concave punchs I use .The big chain ,1/2" I peen .

I grind the rivet heads off,no breaker .Usually it's just repairs or cutting a larger loop down ,like a damaged one to a shorter loop .
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on October 27, 2013, 07:40:48 pm
What 660magnum said. Mostly.

There can also be different rivet diameters for the center (drive links) and / or ends (tie straps) on different brands chains.  And some 'older 1/2" pitch' Oregon chain is different than 'later 1/2" pitch' Oregon chain, etc.. 

That's why you can end up with so many types!

It is a lot easier if you are only matching new chain. More challenging when you are trying to salvage all types, and any brand.

Philbert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: 660magnum on October 27, 2013, 08:24:24 pm
I have a 40 year old loop of non safety Oregon 3/8 semi chisel that is 59DL. I ground all the rocked part from the cutters and it does just fine in the woods. The rakers are straight up and don't have the bulge on their fronts. Cut4fun made a cut with it on a 346 a couple weeks ago and said that he thought it cut pretty good.

I would hate to try to find any chain parts to patch it up if anything happened to it.

I think it was on a Homelite 150XL that someone gave me?
Title: Speaking of Less Common Pre-Sets . . .
Post by: Philbert on November 14, 2013, 12:46:22 am
I received a loop of Sabre chain in good condition.  3/8 Low Profile, with the dual depth gauges.

One link was tight and would not free up right. On inspection, the tie straps were a slightly different shape, so I assumed that it had been over spun. Drove out that link. An Oregon type 91 seemed to fit. Halfway spun it seized up again.

Duh!

It has .058 drive links thinned down to .050. Oregon 3/8 Low Pro drive links are straight .050. Nothing else I have fits.

Any chance someone has a few of these?  Anybody know if Carlton or anything else will fit?

Thanks!

Philbert

Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on November 14, 2013, 01:22:44 pm
OK. Carlton worked.

Philbert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Cut4fun . on November 14, 2013, 01:30:23 pm




It has .058 drive links thinned down to .050. Oregon 3/8 Low Pro drive links are straight .050. Nothing else I have fits.



Thanks!

Philbert



Thanks for sharing that info.   I never paid attention to this stuff like that till here recently.
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on November 14, 2013, 02:15:13 pm
A lot of chain, including some Oregon and STIHL models, use a thicker drive link (.063, or .058) that is thinned down to fit in narrower gauge bars.

This is why, for example, you can use the same pre-sets for many Oregon .050 or .058 chains.  Not usually a problem.

For this 3/8 low profile chain (similar to type 91), Oregon doesn't make a thicker gauge version, so the pre-sets were only made to fit .050 chain.  Oregon does make a thinner version (type 90, .043 gauge), and I see that Bailey's stocks separate pre-sets for those.

The Carlton N2C chain was also 3/8 low profile, .058, but is not listed in the current catalog.  Fortunately, my local dealer has been in business for many years and has an eclectic stock of parts. 

Philbert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Cut4fun . on November 14, 2013, 02:34:40 pm
Speaking of Breakers, Spinners, presets, and tie straps

When you start to buy Stihl presets, they make no mention of the gauge (.050,.058,&.063) I was visiting Cut4fun this afternoon and I brought this up. So we got some Stihl RS33 off the nail and measured the thickness of the drivers. They were .050" where they run though the bar rails BUT were .063" between the tie straps.

In the Internet link supplied in the post earlier about Oregon presets, I noticed the preset numbers were the same for .050" & .058" with a different preset number for the "75" chain. Cut4fun measured some Oregon LGX72 chain and it was .050" where the driver runs through the bar rails but .058" between the tie straps.

With the presets, there is a shoulder where the driver link rides on the rivet. It is a larger diameter than where the rivet goes through the tie strap. The length of this shoulder has to be the same as the thickness of the driver link within the body of the chain itself.

With Oregon chain if you use a .050" preset on .063" gauge chain, it will bind up and be stiff because the shoulder is not long enough. With Oregon, .050" gauge presets will work fine on .058" chain. But .063" presets on .050" chain will be sloppy.

Cut4fun had mentioned years ago that Oregon presets would not work on Stihl chain because the joint would bind. That is because his Oregon presets were for Oregon .050" chain and they had a .058" shoulder on the rivet. Where as Stihl 3/8 chain has drivers that are all .063 thick between the tie straps.

The moral to this story is that Oregon presets for .050" gauge 3/8 chain will mostly work with Oregon .058" gauge chain.

With Stihl 3/8 presets, one size fits all three RS gauges (.050", .058", & .063")

What counts is the thickness of the driver links up inside the chain.

Here is when I started catching on to this stuff.  I was way late to figure out what was going on.
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on November 14, 2013, 08:46:18 pm
Quote
Cut4fun had mentioned years ago that Oregon presets would not work on Stihl chain because the joint would bind

STIHL is another story.  Even if the pitch and gauge of a pre-set fits, the diameter of the rivets may not match the holes in the drive links or tie straps.  Different manufacturers have different specs.   I have seen guys try to drill these holes larger to try and make something fit.

And there are even different versions of some Oregon 1/2 pitch pre-sets that are not compatible!

That is why I mentioned earlier that as long as you are running a few types of current model chains, it is usually not a problem.  Once you start to get into new and old chains from different manufacturers, it can become quite a challenge.

Philbert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: 660magnum on November 14, 2013, 10:59:41 pm
The moral to this story is to keep your chain selection simple so that you can have presets and straps for everything?

Your odd ball stuff is a candidate to go out with the next saw you sell off?
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on November 14, 2013, 11:40:31 pm
Quote
Your odd ball stuff is a candidate to go out with the next saw you sell off?

Or an excuse to fraternize with other oddballs who share your interests  .  .  .

Philbert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: 660magnum on November 14, 2013, 11:45:42 pm
I have a few semi chisel safety chains. I sharpen - tune them up well and use then. They all came on some used saw I purchased. They do OK but I would never buy a new "green" chain.
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: 3000 FPS on November 14, 2013, 11:48:34 pm
I have a few semi chisel safety chains. I sharpen - tune them up well and use then. They all came on some used saw I purchased. They do OK but I would never buy a new "green" chain.

That is exactly what I do also.
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on September 11, 2014, 01:09:42 pm
Bumping up this thread 'cuz we were getting on this topic in an another thread: http://chainsawrepair.createaforum.com/chain/i-think-my-chain-is-screwed-any-tips-are-greatly-appreciated/

Regarding the pre-sets: sometimes you can switch between brands and sometimes you can't.  I got some Windsor pre-sets only (no tie straps) and figured that I scored for Oregon chain.  Turns out the rivet diameter is fine, but the rivet spacing is just a hair off.  I can fit the Windsor pre-sets in the Oregon chain, but not into the Oregon tie straps.  To use them, I will need to drive the pre-set rivets out of another Windsor pre-set, making it into a tie strap (everybody follow, or should I wait for folks to catch up?).  I have done this before, but back to my original comment: 'sometimes you can and sometimes you can't'.

I know that you can do 'field repairs' by grinding a rivet head off and peening over the head of a new one, but I much prefer a spun rivet that looks as close to factory/OEM as possible.  May not actually last longer, but gives me confidence.  I have seen many 'creative' field repairs on chains that need re-work, including: mixed chain/cutter types; upside down/inside out tie straps; 3/8 tie straps used on 3/8 low profile chain; rivets held on by a fingernail of spread; etc.  'My favorite' was the Pop rivet.

Again, to me, a good spinner/breaker set was very empowering.  It has really helped me understand chains more, and let me save a lot of money by repairing/resizing/salvaging usable chains.

Philbert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: 660magnum on September 11, 2014, 01:29:49 pm
I bought a couple 60 DL loops of 3/8" Oregon "CL" square chain from Bailey's.

Now with this chain Bailey's doesn't sell factory loops but spin up custom loops at so much per Driver Link.

When I got the chains, the connecting links had the preset rivets spun over the tie straps with one of those Oregon Electric Spinners. The spinner insert bit was either worn out or the wrong size? The rivets were spun as flat as could be and mashed flat over the tie strap with ragged flashing all around the rivet. Not what you would expect for a so-called professional shop?

Shortly after then, I bought some loops from cut4fun as he had a roll of Oregon CL chain. His loops looked as professional as Oregon factory loops. I was impressed. 
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on September 11, 2014, 01:49:44 pm
Like anything else, skill, practice, and experience play a role!  I don't get every rivet perfect and sometimes redo a preset just 'cause it looks ugly.

I have had reps tell me that the biggest mistakes people make when spinning rivets are: not putting a drop of oil or grease on the rivet head before spinning; pressing too much on the feed/pressure lever and not spinning enough to get a smooth, round head, without any cracks.

Oregon/Tecomec sell a small, electric rivet spinner (for about $600?).  I thought this looked very interesting, but only got negative feedback on it when I asked about it on another site.  What was especially interesting were the spinner heads, which roll, instead of just being a spinning cup.  I would like to try these in my drill press some day.

Madsen's uses a production spinner salvaged from an Oregon factory overhaul many years ago.  It has a motor that looks like it came off of a commercial washing machine!

At a GTG a few years ago, I saw some manual spinners that TreeMonkey's Dad had modified to use a low speed electric drill instead of cranking.  He got good results, but I am sure that some practice would still help with that.

Philbert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: aclarke on September 11, 2014, 01:52:44 pm
Who's a good source for bulk  oregon presets/straps?
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Cut4fun on September 11, 2014, 02:07:57 pm
http://www.psep.biz/store/oregon_3_8_pitch_chain_parts.htm
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on September 11, 2014, 02:51:19 pm
Quote
Who's a good source for bulk  oregon presets/straps?

Pat's Small Engine (above) is good for buying a bunch of identical pre-sets, because of their flat rate shipping.  But if you work on many different sizes of chain, you can end up with quite an investment buying 25 of each type/size, etc.   Bailey's may charge a little more per piece, but they let you buy them onesey-twosey at the same price (and now have $9.99 flat rate shipping - we'll see if that lasts).  So I like to keep a list of what I might need, using their on-line 'wish list', and add that to any existing Bailey's order.  This saves me shipping costs, and sometimes has helped me get up to a $50 minimum for free shipping, or some similar deal.

For STIHL pre-sets I go to my dealer, but do not get any deals there.  Even when I had to spin up 20 62DL chains to 67 DL, requiring 40 pre-sets.  I think he might have even raised the price when he realized his prices were 'out of date'!

Philbert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: aclarke on September 11, 2014, 03:19:15 pm
Thanks...
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: jmester on September 11, 2014, 08:15:24 pm
Would like to find out a little more on the spinner the rolls. From the first pic above. I use a  oil can from TSC and fill with some synthetic 2 stoke oil some one gave me, to lube the preset before I spin them.
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: 660magnum on September 11, 2014, 08:17:36 pm
Most any oil or grease will work OK as long as it doesn't have grit in it.
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on September 11, 2014, 10:41:10 pm
I have a small, plastic, prescription bottle type container (from Walgreens, etc.) with a cap and a toothpick, filled part way with bearing grease, that I keep next to the spinner.  A little dab of grease is easier to place than oil.

I have not personally used a spinner with the roller anvils.

Philbert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: 660magnum on September 11, 2014, 11:21:23 pm
Just as a reference, there is some spinner - breaker information in this thread . . . .

http://chainsawrepair.createaforum.com/chain/herr-chain-breaker-and-spinner-set/
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Al Smith on September 13, 2014, 09:41:57 pm
I once got a flea bay saw from Washington state  ,mac 6-10 with a 24" .058 groove hard nose .Someone had cobbled together a chain with both .058 and .050 drivers.Semi chisel ,full chisel and full chisel semi skip .All in an 80 some driver loop .I laughed when I saw it .I've got it hanging on a nail some place . ;D
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: 3000 FPS on September 13, 2014, 09:53:26 pm
I once got a flea bay saw from Washington state  ,mac 6-10 with a 24" .058 groove hard nose .Someone had cobbled together a chain with both .058 and .050 drivers.Semi chisel ,full chisel and full chisel semi skip .All in an 80 some driver loop .I laughed when I saw it .I've got it hanging on a nail some place . ;D

That is funny Al.
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: fisaw on January 22, 2017, 12:08:27 pm
Bought these a few weeks ago, cast aluminum. I wonder how old these are ? 
(http://u.cubeupload.com/finland1/oregonbreakerspinner.jpg)
(http://u.cubeupload.com/finland1/oregon1.jpg)
(http://u.cubeupload.com/finland1/oregon2.jpg)
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on January 22, 2017, 12:45:13 pm
Nice!

Those are older models, but still supported by Oregon.

Philbert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: 3000 FPS on January 22, 2017, 06:20:20 pm
Nice find Fisaw.
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Al Smith on January 23, 2017, 06:12:03 am
My spinner is exactly like that .Don't own a punch,die grinder gets it  done .
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on January 23, 2017, 01:28:55 pm
A decent spinner / breaker set is not mandtory, but very nice to have - the 'right' tools usually are.

I have a Granberg 'Break-N-Mend'.  It works.  But I would not want to do a lot of chains with it.

You can buy a pocket chain breaker for $17 shipped off of eBay (photo), and peen over the rivets with a small hammer.

I figure that 'in the field' I could remove the heads of rivets with a round sharpening file and wedge the pre-set off with a screwdriver, then peen the heads over with a rock, if I had to, and if I had replacement pre-sets and tie straps, since the original ones would likely be damaged.

Using the breaker instead of filing lets me recover and reuse most tie straps, without damage.  Using the breaker anvil, and a scrap drive link as a die, I also can drive the rivets from the other tie strap (pre-set) and reuse that. Color me 'frugal'.

I would not reuse a full pre-set unless I had to.

Philbert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: fisaw on January 24, 2017, 02:38:53 pm
Nice!

Those are older models, but still supported by Oregon.

Philbert

Thanks for the info
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: HolmenTree on January 24, 2017, 05:37:11 pm
My old Stihl breaker has been good over the years. Recently bought a spinner off of Baileys a few years ago.
1st pic shows part#for the Stihl punches.

2nd pic shows a fullhouse 1/4" carving chain I built out of 2 loops of chain. Did it with the break n mend Grandberg back in the day when I graded lumber at the lumber division. During lunch and coffee breaks. :D
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Al Smith on January 27, 2017, 05:29:36 am
I can spin 3/8" and .404 but having nothing for pico or the occasional 1/4"  I made a set of concave punches from grade 8 bolts .I have closed 1/2" with a little ball peen hammer .
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on January 27, 2017, 11:59:07 pm
Was looking at some carbide insert harvester chain ('Chain-Serts') - their repair instructions specifically said to peen over their rivets with a hammer, suggesting that they could ruin a spinner. Not sure if the Oregon DuraMax spinner / breaker would work.

Philbert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Al Smith on January 28, 2017, 04:28:37 pm
At a GTG in southern Indiana few years back I was going to show a peened 1/2" chain I had on a McCulloch 650 gear drive saw. I could not tell which tie strap I had peened from the rest of them in that loop .They tell me in days before people had spinners about everybody peened their chains .
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: HolmenTree on January 28, 2017, 07:13:00 pm
Was looking at some carbide insert harvester chain ('Chain-Serts') - their repair instructions specifically said to peen over their rivets with a hammer, suggesting that they could ruin a spinner. Not sure if the Oregon DuraMax spinner / breaker would work.

Philbert
I have one of their samples they mailed to me a few years. I was on  MasterBlaster Treehouse site when the Chain-Sert company thought they might find some business. They offered all members a free sample.
Well I guess there was quite a few other then me, because they never posted on the site ever again.
I sent them an  email with all the addresses of all the big logging contractors I know, and they thanked me.
But I cautioned them they won't find much interest from a group of tree monkey hippies on the Tree House site :D

Their product is a pretty cool engineered chain for mechanical harvesters.


Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on January 30, 2017, 09:05:45 pm
I have one of their samples they mailed to me a few years. . . . I cautioned them they won't find much interest from a group of tree monkey hippies on the Tree House site  . . .

So YOU are the reason they did not even respond to me when I asked for a short sample piece!!!

Phiibert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: HolmenTree on January 31, 2017, 12:22:15 pm
I have one of their samples they mailed to me a few years. . . . I cautioned them they won't find much interest from a group of tree monkey hippies on the Tree House site  . . .

So YOU are the reason they did not even respond to me when I asked for a short sample piece!!!

Phiibert
No hard feelings on my part, lol...PM your address and I'll mail you my sample. ;)
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: HolmenTree on February 01, 2017, 03:29:24 pm
I'm in my shop sorting and organizing stuff and I came upon this.
It's an old Cannon chain breaker for 1/2" chain.
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on February 01, 2017, 04:51:57 pm
I'm in my shop sorting and organizing stuff and I came upon this.It's an old Cannon chain breaker for 1/2" chain.

Very cool! It's easy to become accustomed to the current models of things, and not think of how else things could be / could have been done. 

I know that the rivet tools for bicycle chains (generally have a straight shaft rivet, unlike saw chain) commonly use a small, threaded / screw type press to remove and set rivets, but have heard that there is a similar, hand press, that sets the rivet at precisely the correct depth.  These are / were specific to a certain size of chain, but if you were doing a lot of them . . . .

The right tool for the right job!

Philbert

P.S. Bicycle chains used to be a lot more standardized.  Today, there are a variety of different widths, brands, etc. that are not as compatible / interchangeable.  Some have reusable rivets that are pressed in / out, some have single use rivets that are snapped off in place, some use master links, and some require the ends of the rivets to be peened over (but not much as saw chain).
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Al Smith on February 03, 2017, 05:59:24 am
It was common place for old bicycle chains to come apart from the rivets working loose .Also I might add quite painful when you ended up straddling the bar.My father suggested peening the rivets which I did at about 11 years old and never had the problem again .

Another thing I might add is I've completely disassembled a special  double roller chain and replaced all the rollers .It was a hydraulics pump coupling chain for a Caterpillar D4 dozer .I couldn't find a new one but I found a piece of single chain at work with the same sized rollers .
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on February 03, 2017, 01:16:12 pm
BTW - if you live near a Northern Tool retail store they were having closeouts of The Granberg 'Break-N-Mend' tools yesterday for $18, after a 50% off clearance price sale. 
*** Not trying to tease anyone, and none are close to me, but if you were interested you might want to check a local store to see if any are left . . . ****

Philbert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on February 28, 2018, 08:16:25 pm
Tried a New Breaker Anvil

I really wanted to like this one. Slotted anvils are simple, but they fit some chains better than others, and cannot compensate for wear on the tie straps. Threaded anvils are infinitely adjustable, but take a little time to adjust each time they are used. The spring loaded model should have been ideal!

I tried it on a few different pitches of chain: The jaws did not close tight enough for1/4" pitch chain, and did not open wide enough for 3/4" pitch. While it held the 3/8 low profile, .325", 3/8" and .404" chains, it did not like the thinner tie straps on the smaller pitch chains, and slipped off very easily.The 2 halves did not slide as smoothly as I would have liked, due to the rough castings.

I still like the idea. Could work if you mostly use full sized 3/8 and .404 pitch chains. And one that was machined with smoother surfaces and sharper edged jaws might work better with all pitches. I would also like the option to adjust the spring tension.

Philbert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Cut4fun . on March 01, 2018, 08:03:58 am
I got the 2 on the right and middle. So does the one on left do anything better then the other 2?
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on March 01, 2018, 09:36:50 am
So does the one on left do anything better then the other 2?
No. In theory, it would self-adjust to the tie strap. Quick and easy. But this version does not slide smoothly or hold securely. I still like the idea; might be done better.

Philbert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Cut4fun . on March 01, 2018, 10:59:47 am
Where did you find that one at? Cost etc?
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on March 01, 2018, 01:31:38 pm
It is a Tecomec product.  I found this one on eBay for about $18. (Currently out of stock)

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Tecomec-Pro-Anvil-Self-Centering-Chainsaw-Saw-Chain-Vise-breaking-Repair-Tool/381972723351?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2748.l2649

EDIT: also, some information at  http://www.tecomec.com/schede/self_centering_vise/index.htm

Philbert
Title: Re: Chain breaker and spinner
Post by: Philbert on April 30, 2019, 10:06:11 pm
I had the opportunity to try this spinner / breaker combo a short while ago: Tecomec 'Chain Master'.  I really liked the idea of the combined unit and the compact size.

[attachimg=1]

It has a LOT of small pieces to keep track of, including separate breaker anvils for each pitch of chain, and has to be 'switched over' from breaking to spinning, so better for doing batch work.

I was able to work with it, but much easier IMO to use the basic spinner breaker sets, which sell for about the same amount.

Philbert