Chainsaw Repair

Husqvarna - Stihl - Poulan - Jonsered - Dolmar chainsaws and more => Cordless Battery OPE - Corded Electric => Topic started by: Cut4fun on March 19, 2015, 01:18:06 pm

Title: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Cut4fun on March 19, 2015, 01:18:06 pm
@Philbert  I like the looks of that echo cordless chainsaw you were talking about. Seen one? 
I was looking for that Kobalt one the other day. No chainsaw but other stuff was there.

Echo cordless 58v chainsaw

http://www.echocordless.com/products/chain-saw/

http://www.echocordless.com/
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Eccentric on March 19, 2015, 02:08:00 pm
That Echo electric saw is very interesting.  Would be great for cutting in the park during the months when we are under noise restrictions because of the migratory bird nonsense...
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Cut4fun . on March 19, 2015, 02:46:54 pm
That Echo electric saw is very interesting.  Would be great for cutting in the park during the months when we are under noise restrictions because of the migratory bird nonsense...

They take paypal.  ;D

http://www.homedepot.com/p/ECHO-16-in-58-Volt-Lithium-Ion-Brushless-Cordless-Chainsaw-CCS-58V4AH/205566014

(http://www.homedepot.com/catalog/productImages/400/47/4731132f-f145-4a91-a87b-6f3daae14e0f_400.jpg)
(http://www.homedepot.com/catalog/productImages/400/68/681f060c-ff56-4864-8360-5965f03691ac_400.jpg)
(http://www.homedepot.com/catalog/productImages/400/d9/d9020f6d-91ba-496a-a15e-b8653e81ff7f_400.jpg)
(http://www.homedepot.com/catalog/productImages/400/be/bed4cbe7-489b-4086-990f-8081f6831d83_400.jpg)
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Cut4fun . on March 19, 2015, 02:50:53 pm
reviews from owners.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/ECHO-16-in-58-Volt-Lithium-Ion-Brushless-Cordless-Chainsaw-CCS-58V4AH/205566014#customer_reviews




I wonder does that $299 include charger and 1 battery?
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Eccentric on March 19, 2015, 02:52:39 pm
Gonna see if we can get the dealer (that the park has an account with) to let us demo a saw for a spell.  If it lives up to expectations then the park will probably buy a couple plus some batteries.
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Cut4fun . on March 19, 2015, 02:54:41 pm
 Says included at bottom.

Cool on a demo let us know.


The ECHO 58-Volt Cordless Chain Saw is the most advanced, professional grade high voltage cordless Chain Saw in the industry. Featuring a unique brushless motor designed to deliver superior power, run time and durability, the ECHO Chain Saw delivers cutting speeds comparable to gas powered chain saws. Equipped with a 16 in. bar and chain the ECHO Chain Saw is designed for larger, more aggressive cutting. With side access chain tensioning, adjustments are quick and easy. For ultimate convenience, the Chain Saw features an automatic oiler, wrap-around handle and on board tool storage. The Chain Saw, Battery and Charger are all backed by an industry-leading 90-day money-back guarantee, a 5-year consumer warranty and a 2-year commercial warranty.

California residents: seeProposition 65 information

    Brushless motor for superior power, run time and durability
    16 in. bar and chain for larger, more aggressive cutting
    Automatic oiler for optimum oiling and longer chain life
    Wrap around handle for user comfort
    Equipped with an inertia chain brake
    Includes 58-Volt 4.0 Ah lithium-ion battery and 58-Volt lithium-ion charger
    ECHO Cordless Chain Saw Feature:
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Eccentric on March 19, 2015, 02:55:28 pm
Prop 65 just requires retailers to put up a warning that at least some products there contain substances that are known to cause cancer and/or birth defects.  Basically EVERYTHING 'causes' cancer................so the signs are basically everywhere.  I don't even see them anymore.  They're part of the landscape.....

(http://jacobo.tarrio.org/sites/default/files/prop65.png)

(http://images.mysafetysign.com/img/lg/S/cancer-california-prop-65-sign-s-0287.png)

(https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ1ets9vJ3oQYBoe27DeFXkgfMoWYF9Wc2iKjHazl9hE9EzHp90vw)

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51xoAjVjXBL._SX342_.jpg)
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Cut4fun . on March 21, 2015, 06:40:26 pm
Our HD has them in but not put out yet. The guy that runs that section offered to take me back to check one out. I declined as I didnt have a way to take and post pics for you.

He did say it was a HD deal for right now.  Later who knows. Weird IMO. 
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Philbert on March 23, 2015, 05:13:45 pm
Sorry  . . . late to the thread

I was excited to see these.  I have an ECHO CS400 and like it.  Figured that they should do OK making a battery saw - probably better than a non-saw company making one, along with drills, etc.

I was confused by the exclusive Home Depot sales.  Asked around, got a lot of silence, some speculation, and finally, an answer that I have some confidence in.  A marketing rep told me today that these were designed/engineered by ECHO for exclusive sale through The Home Depot right now.  HD, or HomeDepot.com are the only one selling them, and any service would go through one of the HD rental departments.  They should become available in *selected HD stores* in a couple of weeks. *I have a dozen or more HD stores within a 25 mile radius of my house, but only one or two that I know of carry the 40V Ryobi chainsaws, so they must have certain demographics for certain products.  Otherwise, you will be able to order one from HomeDepot.com.

Pricing is $299 with 4.0 AHr battery and charger.
$199 bare tool (no battery, no charger).
$169 for extra 4.0AHr battery.  A 2.0 AHr battery will also be available.

Philbert
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Philbert on March 23, 2015, 05:31:27 pm
I am somewhat disappointed that I cannot buy one from my local ECHO dealer.  I bought my other ECHO saw there.  Lack of dealer service sounds like a general lack of support, or like HD licensed the 'ECHO' name, but it is made by someone else (e.g. like 'Rigid' power tools).  They should not need the service that a two-cycle saw does, but you could still drop it and need parts.

Some people have suggested that ECHO dealers may get them eventually.  With the increased popularity of these cordless saws, I hope they do.  Has to be hard enough to compete against stores like HD on price, let alone to not have access to branded products.

Other than that, I would like to try one.  Brushless motor.  58volts, Li-ion.  ECHO brand.  Looks nice in the videos.  Heck, I would like to try all of them!

*The new, brushless version of the Oregon saw is due out this summer, and am anxious to try that as well!  Supposed to have '40% more power and 50% more torque' (not sure what the difference is).

Philbert
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Nathaniel Vansickle on March 23, 2015, 06:37:22 pm
These were just recently released and they are exclusive to home depot. You have no responsibility in warranties. If someone brings one in for repair, direct them back to home depot.

^^^^^ this is what i was told about them. i am guessing this will not turn out good for the local Echo dealers that see these things turn up for warranty work
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Philbert on March 23, 2015, 06:54:00 pm
reviews from owners. . .

Meant to mention - those are 'seeded reviews'.  The saws are not available yet to the general public.  Home Depot provides some products to selected customers ahead of time to review: they get to keep the product and have to provide a review within 60 days.  That does not mean that these reviews are biased or inaccurate, but they are from people who just got a free saw, and may still be in the honeymoon stage.  Might be different if they just laid out $300 or have used it for a while, so keep that in mind when reading those.

http://www.homedepot.com/c/webapp/catalog/servlet/ContentView?pn=home_depot_seeds_program&storeId=10051&langId=-1&catalogId=10053

Philbert
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Philbert on April 09, 2015, 03:36:47 pm
Tried It Today !

A local Home Depot had reps in today to train their sales staff, and the Manager told me I could listen in. Got a chance to listen to their sales pitch, pester some of the HQ and manufacturer's reps, and try some products alongside some 'competitive' Ryobi, EGO, and Kobalt 40 Volt OPE.

Basic saw specs: 58V; brushless motor; 4.0 Li-Ion battery; 16 inch bar; 3/8 low profile narrow kerf (Oregon Type 90) chain. We only had the opportunity to make cuts in some bundled, treated, 4X4 posts (7.5X7.5" total), so this is a very limited, first impression. But that first impression is very positive. It is clearly the best cordless saw that Home Depot sells. Of course, we did not compare it alongside any of the Husqvarna, STIHL, or Oregon models, so those impressions are still open. But it did discourage me from considering the other models I tried!

The saw has a conventional chain brake, and an electronic brake (chain stops instantly when trigger is released). Well balanced. Easy to operate. Has an overall quality feel to it. Clearly something to look at if you are considering a battery saw. Especially, since HD offers a 90 day money back guarantee and a 5 year consumer warranty.

Also got to try some of the other products in the family, including a leaf blower and string trimmer.  Again, very good, positive, first impressions.

Philbert
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Cut4fun . on April 09, 2015, 06:28:50 pm
Sweet write up and Thanks for letting us know. Sounds good.

From your memory how did the Echo compare to the Oregon you and I both ran? Just a guess.
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Eccentric on April 09, 2015, 07:16:50 pm
Thanks for the update Philbert!  I have not been able to convince the park people to try the Echo yet.  They have some Makita cordless stuff and want to go with a Makita saw that will use their existing batts.  That'll be OK for cutting a few little limbs and such, but.....

Hopefully I can convince them that this Echo would be good to have for the heavier cutting that sometimes has to be done during the bird nesting noise restriction months.  Ugh..........may have to bite the bullet and buy one in hopes of being reimbursed once it's seen in action.  Hmm......
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Philbert on April 09, 2015, 07:52:25 pm
From your memory how did the Echo compare to the Oregon you and I both ran?

t was really fun to run these 3 saws (Kobalt, Ryobi, ECHO) side-by-side with similar chains.  That's the way to do it, and the results were significant. Hard to compare to the Oregon saw from memory, because I never cut pressure treated deck lumber with it!  Also, the PowerSharp chain cuts differently - I did some side-by-side comparisons with PS and standard chain a few years ago, and the PS chain was faster and more aggressive, in that case.

The other issue is the brushless motor.  ECHO has one, and the Oregon one due out in a few months (CS300) will too, so that would be a more apples-to-apples comparison, despite the voltage ratings.  Oregon says to expect 40% more power, which is huge (to quote that real estate guy in New York).

BTW, I told the Store Manager and the Corporate guys that they should do these events for customers too!

I have not been able to convince the park people to try the Echo yet.  They have some Makita cordless stuff and want to go with a Makita saw that will use their existing batts.  Hopefully I can convince them that this Echo would be good to have for the heavier cutting that sometimes has to be done during the bird nesting noise restriction months.

I am 'invested' in the Oregon batteries, so I understand, and have great hopes for their new saw.  If I was starting from scratch, I would take a good look at the ECHO.

As I mentioned, and the sales guy promoted, HD has a 90 day money back guarantee, and a 2 year commercial/5 year residential warranty on the ECHOs, if that helps your situation Aaron.  Also, compare the run time of the 4.0 AH batteries used on these new saws, with the capacity of their drill batteries - might make a difference?

Philbert
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: 660magnum on April 09, 2015, 08:10:36 pm
In my observations of model airplanes, the brushless motors are noticeably superior to the old type.

At first the prices were outrageous for brushless model motors but along come the Chinese and the prices became very affordable.

We changed machinery over to servo drives that are somewhat like the brushless in the way they operate in the late 80's at work. Before that there were stepping motors and before that were Selsyn motors for synchronization between machines.

Early on we experienced some problems with motors that were spec'd out with not enough torque. They would stall out but sound like they were running. The proper electrical pulses were being sent to the motor so it sounded as though it was turning but wasn't.

In model airplanes the more powerful engines sound a lot like piston engines but you are hearing precession of the prop blades and the power impulses of the poles of the motor.
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Cut4fun . on April 28, 2015, 02:12:20 pm
Tried It Today !

A local Home Depot had reps in today to train their sales staff, and the Manager told me I could listen in. Got a chance to listen to their sales pitch, pester some of the HQ and manufacturer's reps, and try some products alongside some 'competitive' Ryobi, EGO, and Kobalt 40 Volt OPE.

Basic saw specs: 58V; brushless motor; 4.0 Li-Ion battery; 16 inch bar; 3/8 low profile narrow kerf (Oregon Type 90) chain. We only had the opportunity to make cuts in some bundled, treated, 4X4 posts (7.5X7.5" total), so this is a very limited, first impression. But that first impression is very positive. It is clearly the best cordless saw that Home Depot sells. Of course, we did not compare it alongside any of the Husqvarna, STIHL, or Oregon models, so those impressions are still open. But it did discourage me from considering the other models I tried!

The saw has a conventional chain brake, and an electronic brake (chain stops instantly when trigger is released). Well balanced. Easy to operate. Has an overall quality feel to it. Clearly something to look at if you are considering a battery saw. Especially, since HD offers a 90 day money back guarantee and a 5 year consumer warranty.

Also got to try some of the other products in the family, including a leaf blower and string trimmer.  Again, very good, positive, first impressions.

Philbert



I was looking to see if they had the Ego saw in that group.

Seen it in the Home Depot ad.

The EGO Power Chainsaw is the most powerful rechargeable product of its kind. The first-ever 56-Volt lithium-ion battery has 40% more power than the leading 40-Volt battery. The 14 in. bar and chain combined with a hi-efficiency brushless motor provides a smooth cut. The brushless motor extends the life of the tool and the run time. The EGO Power Chainsaw delivers the performance of gas without the noise, fuss and fumes.

Ego Chain Saws 14 in. 56-Volt Electric Cordless Chainsaw

(https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/shopping?q=tbn:ANd9GcRryKxWBhjQdxipC_2z8OCFptFgJ8GyZD7QkN6_cC5BCTJK4VnvXv3unFbsCHhcTBuHv_WIxjqx&usqp=CAY)

Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Philbert on April 28, 2015, 07:15:52 pm
We have to be careful with numbers.  The ECHO claims 58 volts - more than the Ego's 56 volts, or just measured differently?  The 40 volt and 36 volt batteries are reportedly 'the same'.  Bottom line has to be what they do with those volts and amps - how they actually work in the wood: speed, torque, battery life, etc.  Hard to know without side-by-side tests. 

Everyone seems to agree that brushless motors are better, all things equal.  Brushless STIHL better than brushed STIHL.  Brushless Oregon better than brushed Oregon. Etc.

HD did not have the Ego one to compare against the ECHO -  maybe on purpose? I heard that they might be available in more markets, outside of HD, down the road.

The concern I would have would be support later on.  Some people might be happy with a $300 - $400 tool that lasts the life of the battery.  My expectation is that some of these tools will be around longer, and supported longer, than some others.  Maybe stores like Batteries Plus will be able to rebuild these Li-Ion batteries if NLA from manufacturers in a few years?  Hard to know.

Philbert
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Philbert on May 01, 2015, 12:49:00 pm
I have not been able to get the reps to answer a few more technical questions on the ECHO line.  But did find some answers deep in the Q&A on the HD website for some of these products.  I would feel a lot more confident if I could get a direct answer from an ECHO cordless, or Home Depot rep.

- It "sounds" like the batteries are covered under the five year warranty, for residential use only. Not sure how you would prove or document this. HD may actually be more casual about this, than an ECHO dealer.

- ECHO clearly states that you cannot charge their batteries using a 12 V inverter in your vehicle. Oregon says that you can charge their batteries as long as it is the right kind of inverter (pure sine wave?).

- Still unclear which accessories can be used with their string trimmer powerhead. Apparently, some ECHO attachments will fit, but may not have adequate power. For example, I can't get an answer about using a pole saw attachment.

Philbert
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Cut4fun on May 01, 2015, 04:26:37 pm
Interesting digging.   Keep us updated. Thanks
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Cut4fun . on May 04, 2015, 01:23:27 pm
Knew Ego had one. Now Echo 58-Volt Lithium-Ion Walk-Behind Brushless Cordless Mower 

If you had a small lot in town I think these would be pretty neat.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/ECHO-21-in-58-Volt-Lithium-Ion-Walk-Behind-Brushless-Cordless-Mower-CLM-58V4AH/205566037?cm_mmc=socialmedia-_-20150427-_-Facebook-_-Echo58V-_-EchoMowerThd1-_-W01
Title: STIHL Too!
Post by: Philbert on May 04, 2015, 01:48:22 pm
http://www.stihlusa.com/products/battery/lawn-mower/rma370/

I live on a 50 X 150 foot city lot, and use an electric lawnmower.  I have see some of these smaller, batter lawnmowers, and thought that they might be better for some smaller, highly landscaped lots, where a lot of the traditional lawn has been replaced with flowering beds, shrubs, patios, stonework, etc.  All of the low noise/easy start/low maintenance advantages of electric, and easier to maneuver, no cord to drag.  Not a lot of grass to mow, and more even cutting than using just a string trimmer.

Philbert
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Nathaniel Vansickle on May 04, 2015, 05:15:11 pm
since their isnt a 36V Echo thread i will add it here...later on i may start a new thread just to update it and give a progress report as time passes.

This weekend I took one of the 36V echo trimmers home to use. Not bad but it could use a little more battery life which the 58V equipment should have. To be fair this is the first time i trimmed around the shop this year(still havent mowed yet) and the grass was an easy foot tall in spots. Had the son trim around my main shop 36x48, the storage shed 8x24, and the other storage buiding 24x24. took 2 full batteries to do that. He trimmed out from the buildings a foot to 2 feet in places and underneath a couple tractors. trimmer seems to have plenty of power on the high setting but even when the grass was thin and short i found the low setting to be almost useless. It just spins the head so slow that it takes going over a section several times to get all the grass cut. Overall i like it and from the little bit i have used it i would recommend it to  somebody in town with no hesitation. And the .080 Silentwist line that comes on really impressed me with how durable it was. We should be giving it a good workout because i took it to the farm to use there so it will be abused trimming creek banks and waist high weeds. These have a 3 year warranty for consumer use and NO commercial warranty.

Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Cut4fun . on October 31, 2015, 08:31:58 pm
IMO after picking up one yesterday ready to use.  To heavy for my likings for a small trim saw around the house.  No cuts made just checking it out.

http://www.echocordless.com/products/chain-saw/
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Philbert on November 01, 2015, 01:00:36 pm
IMO after picking up one yesterday ready to use.  To heavy for my likings for a small trim saw around the house.  No cuts made just checking it out.

'Picked one up', like in the store, just to get the feel of it; or 'picked one up', like bought one to try out?

I would like to try one side-by-side with my Oregon CS300, brushless saw, but don't want to buy one with the intent of returning it.  Would like to find someone local who has one for a mini-GTG.

Philbert
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Cut4fun . on November 01, 2015, 01:15:54 pm
Picked one up in store. No way I would buy now after seeing weight.   Almost has heavy as a 70cc.  Felt like carrying a 290-390 around.

Still have their place though. Just not in my place.
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Cut4fun . on November 08, 2015, 10:28:20 am
Picking up some lights at lowes I took a detour.  ;D

There was a yellow Dewalt looking battery powered chainsaw that looked just like the echo version.

Trying to find inf now.
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Philbert on November 08, 2015, 12:19:57 pm
There was a yellow Dewalt looking battery powered chainsaw that looked just like the echo version.

Clearly, some similarities in appearance, with the center-mounted battery.But 40V vs 58 volt indicates different motor, etc.

http://www.dewalt.com/tool-categories/outdoorpe.aspx

http://www.dewalt.com/tools/outdoor-power-tool-equipment-dccs690m1.aspx

http://www.echocordless.com/products/chain-saw/

Philbert
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Tintcutter on March 24, 2016, 12:18:59 pm
One year later and now the insight of time spent with one of these Echo CCS-58V 4AH saws has brought me some subtle but important points about the saw. Basically I trashed it, rebuilt it, and am learning to get along with it.

Point One: This had to be the idea that the battery button was/is like the primer bulb. That took a while to figure out and had me pissed/worried/feeling stupid. Mainly felt stupid because I didnt appreciate Li as a flammable and missed a Safety Idea about discharge rates.

Point Two: This echo works best if it is considered a polesaw type cutter, inasmuch as its running a 16" picco type chain. This will also save you from bending the blade, like I did, and possibly ripping out the oiler in anger, as I also did.

Point Three: It turns out parts are available by internet, mine came out of Fla for some reason, and there are actually not many parts. 2 bearings move, the clutch is hollowed out because it not needed.  Trigger and chain.  There is an oil pump.

Point Four: The machine reads torque, electrically, and temps maybe too since they are an expression of energy, midrun shutdowns can be related to things like overtight new chains, also less that lubricity in the oil. Also if the chain is not oiling well. I  think this a sensitivity.  In fact, I think some slickum additive for the oil would increase the performance window that the protection chips are set to allow.

That is all
Title: Re: Echo cordless 58v chainsaw
Post by: Tintcutter on March 24, 2016, 01:46:54 pm
Due to the dielectric properties of silicone, its water resistant nature, its heat resistant nature and its insulating properties anongst wires, i am seriously considering silicone enhanced lubrication for this saw instead of the traditional chain oil. My viscosity needs would seem fairly traditional, except that plating properties can be improved. If you have suggestions, post them. Right now I am floating between Astroglide and Breakfree Machine gun oil.