Chainsaw Repair
Husqvarna - Stihl - Poulan - Jonsered - Dolmar chainsaws and more => Husqvarna => Topic started by: William Greene on March 22, 2012, 05:01:31 pm
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these two saws are my first out of the box and out the door.
the 562 went with 24" .058 JG oregon chain and powermatch guide bar. 100LL AV gas and mobil 2t syntetic mix oil. aint heard nothin' yet since 1/26/12
the 555 18" .058 LGX not so lucky. today i just swapped carbs. the original was a EL44B141A. it gave me trouble right from the get go. would not idle.would not restart warm. would only start up cold. i ran 1 gallon of 100LL AV gas mixed with black bottle xp premium mix oil (now called low smoke) thru the saw cutting disc's. did 2 resets,and 1 master reset....no help. then i changed the carb that came on it with a carb husqvarna sent me EL44B147A when i told them of my problem with this saw.now the saw starts great and runs & cuts good,all i did was change the carb.this saw is well thought out and easy to work on (so far) i like the software that come with the hook-up tool you plug into the computer. i'm looking forward to working on these new saws,as they come in for service work because now i know the operator cant "play" with the carb adjustments.and the running info can be downloaded for me to see what the saw has been doing. what do you suppose the difference is between a 141a and a 147a is ???? I took the plug in off the original carb , and put it on the replacement carb-so i would not lose all the info stored in it from the beginning start up. i have pic's of all the downloads i have on this saw that you can see , if anybody wants to see them. i'd like to know how everybody else's experience's of these two saws are. and how the customers like them.
(http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/555Largee-mailview.jpg) (http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/555Largee-mailview.jpg)
(http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/555aLargee-mailview.jpg) (http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/555aLargee-mailview.jpg)
(http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/555bLargee-mailview.jpg) (http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/555bLargee-mailview.jpg)
(http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/555cLargee-mailview.jpg) (http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/555cLargee-mailview.jpg)
(http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/555dLargee-mailview.jpg) (http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/555dLargee-mailview.jpg)
this one is FINALLY ready to go out the door ;) ;D
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That's way cool. I'd love to play with it, too. Do you need help? <grin>
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Mr Greene
It would be very interesting to the rest of us if you could make a "copy and paste" of the data logger output (maybe on the 555) and make comments on the post for us to learn just what information is available. I have a half dozen Huskies but have stayed away from the "5 series" because of lack of knowledge of the computer interface.
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here's the first data download:
(http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/auto%20tune%20diagnostics/1STTIME.jpg) (http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/auto%20tune%20diagnostics/1STTIME.jpg)
there is'nt a whole lot of info that is usefull at this point.now off to the second download:
(http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/auto%20tune%20diagnostics/2NDTIME.jpg) (http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/auto%20tune%20diagnostics/2NDTIME.jpg)
i ran the saw cutting disc's for about 4-5 minutes at wot the first time let off throttle,it dies and cannot restart un till cold. download no.3:
(http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/auto%20tune%20diagnostics/3RDTIME.jpg) (http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/auto%20tune%20diagnostics/3RDTIME.jpg)
i have 8 download sheets on this saw plus 2 comparison sheets after performing reset to saw trying to get improvement in running characteristics,without any luck.
i find that side by side sheets easier to read and think about. vs one above the other, like above. i'll post more after you guys have some comments.
(http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/auto%20tune%20diagnostics/COMPARISONOFAFTERRESET.jpg) (http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/auto%20tune%20diagnostics/COMPARISONOFAFTERRESET.jpg)
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Thanks for the nice post showing the data logs of a chainsaw. Looks like our future is going to be different relative to chainsaw service.
Like reading the data file of my pacemaker and the Dr. wanting to know if I was running a chainsaw again on Friday at 9AM.
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In my career doing tech support in the "power" industry, I had a front-row seat working the change from analog to digital controls.
IMO, this is the future - smaller, cheaper, more feature-rich, eco-friendly. That being said, there will be occasions when you'll wish for the 'old, hands-on' tech. Thanks to the poster for the excellent photos and the diagnostic info. Interesting stuff!
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I fail to see were it is smaller, lighter or more eco friendly.
It will be lots of saws cooked and that is just recurses waisted. If you look at it from a global point of view, better would be to improve a model in use already so parts and tools/machines can be used for more than one product.
As you are in development, you know how much money and resources it is spent each new model.
There should not be problems like the crap William went thru on a pro grade saw. It is too expencive to spend this much time and effort on to get running. If they knew what problem there was, out with a service bulletin so the dealers know. No point in hiding it under carpet, it just **** people of as all need to learn the hard way instead of one or two, then all know.
Good to hear it is running, William.
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On the data output under parameter values, current fuel setting (H/L), do these correspond to percentages?
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i'm guessing that the higher the number the richer the setting
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Is there a way to tell at what percentage the carb is flowing at wot in the cut? Say like a woods ported saw and if the carb is just about flowing all it can adjust to. Is there a way to tell?
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One thing I noticed is the tracking of hours at full throttle (warranty considerations?). But I'm really surprised how much adjustment is being performed in real time.
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last saturday the problem 555 found a new home. i'll report back the downloaded data it has accumulated when it walks back in.
i took number 2 555 out of the box and hooked it up to the computer, getting it ready for sale.AND it flunked out too!!! the auto tune unit hooked to the carb did not work.could not hear the "ticking" that is needed to pass test. luckily i had auto tune unit from the last saw job. i put that one on this saw,and it starts good,runs good,and restarts warm good. so its on to the shelf ready for sale.
(http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/555NUMBER2FIRSTHOOK-UP.jpg) (http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/555NUMBER2FIRSTHOOK-UP.jpg)
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The "ticking" sound, that a solenoid or stepper motor? Anyway, frustrating in situations like this. Part of the learning curve for both field forces as well as the manufacturer. One would expect these probs eventually work themselves out. And valuable experience you wouldn't get any other way.
As for the digital data bus, only a matter of time before the software is hacked and then let the (real) tuning begin <g>
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YES!...your right on all accounts.
i just sold 562 # 2 and it fired right up and ran good.restarted warm too.
i wonder why my track record with these two model's is like it is???? i sure am glad that 562 start's right up and run's good in front of buying customer! and as you can see why i get 555 ready before hand. i firmly beleive that anyone buying a new version saw like these saws-is not going to put up with much "running troubles demonstrated to them" ......before they even leave the dealers establishment :o
i'd like to know more about these saws,AND i'd like to read here about other dealers "stories"
one "little bit" about this latest version of saw i'd like to share. the "XP" version is much better cutting than non-XP version. always has been.even since i started back in the early 70's.the power to weight ratio certainly is getting much better that's for sure.the package you lug around sure does cut good.
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Feel your pain as I, too, have been baffled going word-for-word in the instruction manuals with no luck, only to find-out the instructions were wrong. That happens a LOT more these days than back in the day, the old military and Bell System manuals being especially detailed and precise.
In your case it could be as simple as an improper digital handshake or some such nonsense.
I agree it would be beneficial for all to involve other dealers in the learning curve. Maybe you should re-title and re-post your thread, and post in this and other good forums (Arboristsite, ForestryForum, others).
Good luck! If I'm up your way I'll stop in for a chat. Steve
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we donot even have the 562 up here yet and I know my dealer close to home asked Husky about the programming equipment and husky knew nothing of this stuff nor knew anything about that saw , seems very strange they put out something not 110% tested
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we donot even have the 562 up here yet and I know my dealer close to home asked Husky about the programming equipment and husky knew nothing of this stuff nor knew anything about that saw , seems very strange they put out something not 110% tested
thanks for the info, seems that i've seen the same type of comments on different forums. i'm with you on how they market their product(s)
my own salesman asked "how'd you get that" .....when i was telling him about my first 555 i was having trouble with!!
i sure am looking to see more info / comments in this thread
you looking for auto tune outfit? pm me if interested
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William, when I was demoing the 562 at my dealers. I had ask about the autotune diagnostic tool etc and they didnt have it.
From what you have shown here. It seems it should be a must for the dealers to have to set the autotune up correctly with updates etc before being sold. Do you feel the same way on this?
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From what you have shown here. It seems it should be a must for the dealers to have to set the autotune up correctly with updates etc before being sold. Do you feel the same way on this?
Agree 100%
It seems Husqvarna does a terrible job keeping the dealers informed. The dealer that I purchase my saws from does not have the tool and did not know it existed. A guy is flying blind without one.
From what I have read, it is not a percentage of fuel flow. I ran mine with an intentional air leak to search for the limit. The info is written down somewhere......will do some searching as one of my "notebooks" is missing.
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It seems you are having a high rate of failure though. It is a misconception that these new saws are set/ready to roll out of the box(not saying you fall into this category). There has been many instances of the metering lever being way to low, causing the saw to accelerate poorly and start hard warm and hot. Also the pop off pressure is for some reason very high. I clipped one ring off my 562 and it starts well at any temp.
Why the 100 fuel? Just curious. My 562 handles the transition from 87 to 92 flawlessly but vice versa, it takes a tank to adjust.
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In the systems I'm familiar with... which I admit *isn't chainsaws*.... measuring true fuel flow entails sophisticated electronic$.
For conversation sake, let's say the mixture adjusting is via a stepper motor. If so, the software would have a "first start" (or whatevfer you want to call it) initialize routine that finds the low limit ('0') and high limit ('100'). Thereafter you would measure digital pulses (count) required to keep within the feedback loop.
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The inputs are throttle position, carb temp and rpm. I'm sure it has a set/default parameter that it plays off. It seems to me, the issues for the most part are carb flaws which in turn will not allow the fuel control system to work within its "values"
www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBXvPFko0a0 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBXvPFko0a0)
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William, when I was demoing the 562 at my dealers. I had ask about the autotune diagnostic tool etc and they didnt have it.
From what you have shown here. It seems it should be a must for the dealers to have to set the autotune up correctly with updates etc before being sold. Do you feel the same way on this?
kevin, i could not imagine selling or starting up one of these new generation saws with out the proper tools!!! the dealers that have no tool or woodpile , certainly will be at a dis-advantage to say the least!
It seems you are having a high rate of failure though. It is a misconception that these new saws are set/ready to roll out of the box(not saying you fall into this category). There has been many instances of the metering lever being way to low, causing the saw to accelerate poorly and start hard warm and hot. Also the pop off pressure is for some reason very high. I clipped one ring off my 562 and it starts well at any temp.
Why the 100 fuel? Just curious. My 562 handles the transition from 87 to 92 flawlessly but vice versa, it takes a tank to adjust.
the reason for 100LL AV fuel is because i see so much trouble with ethanol fuel that come into my saw shop, i'd like to start out with the best grade of ethanol free fuel that i can get ahold of. (it certainly has been working real nice in my stuff) the customer has choice on what he wants to run. i try and tell them to run premium grade gas and not the low grade. i'm expecting to be able to see the differences in gas , in the download data from each saw . because the customer is keeping me in tune with his gas (hopefully)
nice post you added to my thread. just the stuff i was lookin' for!!!!
keep it comming.
i consider my high failure rate as "luck of the draw"......i've not had to many failures over the years to get all shook up about. all though 20 out of 25 of the first 455's i got, was an eye opener!
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the reason for 100LL AV fuel is because i see so much trouble with ethanol fuel that come into my saw shop, i'd like to start out with the best grade of ethanol free fuel that i can get ahold of. (it certainly has been working real nice in my stuff) the customer has choice on what he wants to run. i try and tell them to run premium grade gas and not the low grade. i'm expecting to be able to see the differences in gas , in the download data from each saw . because the customer is keeping me in tune with his gas (hopefully)
i consider my high failure rate as "luck of the draw"......i've not had to many failures over the years to get all shook up about. all though 20 out of 25 of the first 455's i got, was an eye opener!
I hear you on the ethanol. Any equipment that sits for an extended period will have issues. So far I am fortunate to have non alky 87,89,91,92 locally but I see that changing soon.
And to your point, this system is a god send for taking the customer out of the equation. Short of raw fuel that is. Did you generate a return for the faulty 555 carb? If not I would be interested in the height and pop off....or the possession of the carb in question.
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HVA warranteed the first 555 and i'm working on second one now. i still have the faulty carb here as they did'nt want it back.
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Mr. Green, for what its worth sir, the 562xp is by far the best stock saw "Ive" ever owned. I like it that much. Take into consideration though my experienced is very limited. Ive owened 372xpw,395xp,390xp,555,346xp ans 2171. But like I stated earlier the 562xp really does it for me. I can certainly agree with you also about the 562xp cutting better than the 555. Thats to take nothing away from the 555 as I felt it was a great saw too. I sold the 555 to a friend and later on when I got the 562xp we decided to run them head to head per say. I thought going into it there wouldnt be much difference at all. The 555 actually had a few tanks ran thru her as well as a muffler mod. The 562xp was never fueled. The difference in cutting speed was noticeable. The 562xp also spooled up better. Just more saw IMHO. I will say as for the 555, i only had 1 episode that she didnt want to fire warm. That was easily fixed by taking the plug out and putting a little fuel in the plug hole. She then fired up and never has missed a beat that i know of.
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sawking made a video. Maybe something there for you guys and this thread.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lb8ZjHM5uco
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bummer. The video has been "removed by user"
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UjDFcgjv-U4&feature=g-u-u&context=G251119dFUAAAAAAAEAA
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Well the 562xpg models are now listed for sale so I might have one next week if all goes well. Been holding out for the heated edition forever.
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Well the 562xpg models are now listed for sale so I might have one next week if all goes well. Been holding out for the heated edition forever.
It is well worth it! ;)
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You asked the question about the difference between 141A and 147A on your carburetor.
The breakdown is this way, the first digit is the last charater of the year. 2011 becomes a 1 and the next two digits are the week of the year so 41 was the 41st week and 47 is the 47th week. Bear in mind factory wise there can be 53 weeks.
so 141A is 2011 and was likely built between 10th October and 16th October
and 147A is 2011 and was likely built between 21 Novemeber and 27th November
Also there were comments about service bulletins, yes there was a bulletin that came out much later about hot restart problems, it is the carburetor that is at fault.
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You asked the question about the difference between 141A and 147A on your carburetor.
The breakdown is this way, the first digit is the last charater of the year. 2011 becomes a 1 and the next two digits are the week of the year so 41 was the 41st week and 47 is the 47th week. Bear in mind factory wise there can be 53 weeks.
so 141A is 2011 and was likely built between 10th October and 16th October
and 147A is 2011 and was likely built between 21 Novemeber and 27th November
Also there were comments about service bulletins, yes there was a bulletin that came out much later about hot restart problems, it is the carburetor that is at fault.
Welcome to the site and Thanks for sharing this info. Enjoy and help us out where you can so we all can learn.
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You asked the question about the difference between 141A and 147A on your carburetor.
The breakdown is this way, the first digit is the last charater of the year. 2011 becomes a 1 and the next two digits are the week of the year so 41 was the 41st week and 47 is the 47th week. Bear in mind factory wise there can be 53 weeks.
so 141A is 2011 and was likely built between 10th October and 16th October
and 147A is 2011 and was likely built between 21 Novemeber and 27th November
Also there were comments about service bulletins, yes there was a bulletin that came out much later about hot restart problems, it is the carburetor that is at fault.
i'd like to see service bulletin,if possible.
thanks for posting the info so far.very nice info!!!
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i'd like to see service bulletin,if possible.
thanks for posting the info so far.very nice info!!!
I looked and couldn't find one specific. Not to say it doesn't exist, just didn't see it as Husky doesn't really announce said bulletins.
I've not had one hot start issue yet, been lucky. The only good explanation I've gotten was from Spike saying the coil doesn't hold a strong charge when hot. He may be able to elaborate more.
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i'd like to know where and how the info given was obtained.....it looks interesting....but how?
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On the ethanol debate...
Not defending this or trying to say it is good in any way, but the problem is not the ethanol itself.
There were saws test run here on E-85 a couple years back.
Biggest problems I find with the E10-E15 is that the oil need to mix, it can't be stored and resetting of saws more frequently as fuels change.
The aggressive stuff in fuels is not the alcohol. Finding oil that mix with Alcohol is not always easy.
It would be better to use good quality fuel with good oil in proper ratio. Much friendlier to environment.
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On the ethanol debate...
Not defending this or trying to say it is good in any way, but the problem is not the ethanol itself.
There were saws test run here on E-85 a couple years back.
Biggest problems I find with the E10-E15 is that the oil need to mix, it can't be stored and resetting of saws more frequently as fuels change.
The aggressive stuff in fuels is not the alcohol. Finding oil that mix with Alcohol is not always easy.
It would be better to use good quality fuel with good oil in proper ratio. Much friendlier to environment.
That right there is why I run my Klotz 200 or 100, it mixes with ethanol, methanol etc and stays mixed. Even though it dont have rust inhibitors for thos high humid areas.
KL 200 or KL 100
http://klotzlube.com/techsheet.asp?ID=54
http://www.klotzlube.com/techsheet.asp?ID=44
Warning R50 does NOT stay mixed with ethanol gas. Straight from Klotz tech.
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On the ethanol debate...
Not defending this or trying to say it is good in any way, but the problem is not the ethanol itself.
There were saws test run here on E-85 a couple years back.
Biggest problems I find with the E10-E15 is that the oil need to mix, it can't be stored and resetting of saws more frequently as fuels change.
The aggressive stuff in fuels is not the alcohol. Finding oil that mix with Alcohol is not always easy.
It would be better to use good quality fuel with good oil in proper ratio. Much friendlier to environment.
here is a video that magnus and i made over at his place,and the fuel is "swedish fuel". but american fuel is very much the same. not much aspen fuel here yet,but it's gaining it's place in the market here steadily everyday.
http://s116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/?action=view¤t=swedentrip2007077.mp4
the stryrofoam dissolves in "gas".....but not aspen fuel.
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On the ethanol debate...
Not defending this or trying to say it is good in any way, but the problem is not the ethanol itself.
There were saws test run here on E-85 a couple years back.
Biggest problems I find with the E10-E15 is that the oil need to mix, it can't be stored and resetting of saws more frequently as fuels change.
The aggressive stuff in fuels is not the alcohol. Finding oil that mix with Alcohol is not always easy.
It would be better to use good quality fuel with good oil in proper ratio. Much friendlier to environment.
here is a video that magnus and i made over at his place,and the fuel is "swedish fuel". but american fuel is very much the same. not much aspen fuel here yet,but it's gaining it's place in the market here steadily everyday.
http://s116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/?action=view¤t=swedentrip2007077.mp4
the stryrofoam dissolves in "gas".....but not aspen fuel.
Fixed grr still got to click on pic and it takes you same place to watch. Oh well I tried.
(http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/th_swedentrip2007077.jpg) (http://s116.photobucket.com/albums/o8/WILLIAMFGREENE/?action=view¤t=swedentrip2007077.mp4)
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works for me. at both places.( i'm not a good computer operator either)
thanks for fixing.
does it work for anyone else???????? ;)
or does in not work?......i'm gonna go get another beer & wait & watch fer a while.
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i'd like to see service bulletin,if possible.
thanks for posting the info so far.very nice info!!!
I looked and couldn't find one specific. Not to say it doesn't exist, just didn't see it as Husky doesn't really announce said bulletins.
I've not had one hot start issue yet, been lucky. The only good explanation I've gotten was from Spike saying the coil doesn't hold a strong charge when hot. He may be able to elaborate more.
Husqvarna doesn't make bulletins available to consumers, however all dealers should have access. I just looked and the bulletin has been changed it mentions the vent being the problem.
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Yes I have access. I've seen carb issues but not a sb on one for hot start. Like i said, doesn't mean it didn't/doesn't exist.
The vent has been brought to my attention though.
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I had talked to one of the teachers, he had told me the problem was the main nozzle in the carb and that the hard restart was a bad ignition coil.
Then he told me if you change the coil out you have to put a new carb on all under warranty because they are mated with one another.
Said can not use the new coil with original carburetor says they run at different frequencies (HZ) like 60HZ here and 50 HZ in Europe but those were not the frequencies just an example that they are different. He had the bulletin, I saw it but didn't have time to fully read it. I thought it was online. I should have checked online first before opening my mouth.
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that's what i was told too.......
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Dang my local dealer is selling 555 20" set ups for $529.95
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the 555 here with a 16"b/c is $700ish :D
one place in ottawa is advertizing $704 with no tax this week.
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the 555 here with a 16"b/c is $700ish :D
one place in ottawa is advertizing $704 with no tax this week.
From what I have read on husky prices up in Canada. That seems to be really good prices for up there. Yes?
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From what I have read on husky prices up in Canada. That seems to be really good prices for up there. Yes?
yes it is. $80 bucks less than the 346 ::), and you have the taxes on top of that.